What's unique about your favorite submarine museum?

[Paul Farace]

Regarding DRUM's conning tower... the fairwater (superstructure surrounding the CT pressure vessel) is typical GATO Connestoga wagon (three frames supporting shears)... maybe the pressure vessel is BALAO, but what surrounds it is standard GATO.  I remember hearing something about replacing her CT, but I can't remember what was said (hey, I'm 50 and losing it!!!).

It's also the "shoe submarine" (story to be told at a later date).  Just couldn't help but play games with former director Frank Dengler!

Paul

[Lance Dean]

Regarding DRUM's conning tower... the fairwater (superstructure surrounding the CT pressure vessel) is typical GATO Connestoga wagon (three frames supporting shears)... maybe the pressure vessel is BALAO, but what surrounds it is standard GATO.  I remember hearing something about replacing her CT, but I can't remember what was said (hey, I'm 50 and losing it!!!).

It's also the "shoe submarine" (story to be told at a later date).  Just couldn't help but play games with former director Frank Dengler!

Paul

I just recall something leaking so badly they couldn't dive (or dive deep) and even after welding on it they couldn't stop the leaking.  So the tower was replaced.

This is something I didn't know.  Apparently the old conning tower off of the USS Drum is at Great Lakes Naval and Memorial Museum near the USS Silversides??

http://www.murdoconline.net/archives/004823.html   Scroll down the page and you'll see what I'm talking about.

[Dave595]

The Razorback is the latest submarine to be added to the museum subs inventory.
She has the distinction of having the most years in service among all the museum subs around the world.
Only one sub (still in commission) has longer service.  Can anyone name that sub?

Based on the transfer of "the cribbage board", I would have to say that the USS Los Angeles has the longest service of the boats still in commission.  http://www.csp.navy.mil/news/rel070511.html

"OUR" submarine here in Portland, OR; is the U.S.S. Blueback (SS 581).  One of the things that make her unique is that she was the last diesel boat to be put in commission.  Of her class the U.S.S. Barbel (SS 580) and U.S.S. Bonefish (SS 582) were both put in commission before her.    She is also one of the first class of submarine to use teardrop or "albacore" hull.  Blueback served in commission for 31 years!

[Tom Bowser]

The door frame at the aft end of the coning tower was cracked and it flooded the tower. Pearl harbor tryed to repair but the tower buckled on test dive so they had to go to Mare Island to get the new one. The deck support frames maybe Gato but the periscope shears and support is Balao.
Tom Bowser

[Fred Tannenbaum]

Regarding the Drum "conning tower" at the Silversides: That is a replica built by the folks at the Alabama battleship memorial, not the original. The Silversides folks acquired it around 1997-98.

[Travis McLain]

So where is the original one? Did they just scrap it?

[Tom Bowser]

Most likely as it was remove in 1943 and they had no reason to save it. Also at the time they were changing out most of the conning towers and getting rid of the door in the aft end.
Tom Bowser

[Rick]

Mine should be obvious.  In addition to Travis' post.  I have to add,  where else are you going to find a submarine that was all but forcibly hauled up a river as far as she would go by a group or old sub vets and planted in the middle of a bean field.   LOL

[Travis McLain]

You are correct there Rick.

[Paul Farace]

Without specific information from the shipyard about how bad the damage to DRUM's conning tower was and how it was fixed,  I will say that when orders came down to remove the aft doors on the conning towers of the early Gato CTs (COD was built without one) the Navy simply had their aft ends cut off (think circumcision) and new solid caps welded in place. The caps were also dishd outwards instead of the pervious inward dishing, to provide badly needed interior room. The shears on DRUM, from my photos, are GATO. BALAO boats don't have the connestoga wagon "shoulders" because the heavy plating on the scope shears is strong enough to be free standing. Given the vast amount of work needed to cut out a CT barrel and put in a new one with all of the cables, scopes, piping, etc., I would have to suggest that what DRUM got was a new CT end cap and not a complete new barrel. This is common among historic ships: tribal knowledge becomes gospel because nobody goes back far enough to know better and rumor, speculation, and someone's interpretation becomes fact. Like the CT barrel at SILVERSIDES... someone saw it at BB ALABAMA and assumed it was from DRUM?  DRUM came to AL from DC where it was a dockside trainer... any pieces parts from WWII would have been scapped loooong ago.

For the sake of DRUM history, I would like to really dig to the bottom of the CT issue Tom.
What specifically can you cite regarding a full replacement?

Thanks!
PF

[Tom Bowser]

How about the machinery history records, or do you think they are wrong also. and you need to study the differences in shears more.
Tom

[Fred Tannenbaum]

I'd check the introductory paragraphs or pages of the war patrol report for the patrol immediately following the Mare Island overhaul. Every war patrol report usually starts off discussing what modifications were made to the boat.

[Tom Bowser]

Already done that but I didn't think Paul would believe that either.
Tom

[Tom Bowser]

Also I forgot to add statements from the crew members that were on the boat when the conning tower was cracked and rode the boat to the shipyard and after including the 4th skipper who made 11 patrols on the Drum and retired as a rear admiral. Of course all we have to do is drill a hole thru it and measure the thickness.
Tom

[Paul Farace]

Tom:

I wasn't calling you a liar -- rather I wanted to know what you had as evidence. (I am rarely considered a Doubting Thomas, but I have been fooled a few times)... The Gato-like shoulders threw me off... but after inspecting lots of photos of DRUM's upper shears, I have to admit, they sure don't look like the ones on SILVERSIDES or other early GATOs and do look a heck of a lot like the upper portions of a BALAO shear. But why didn't they (Mare Island) just do the whole thing as a new conning tower? It would seem easier, faster, and cheaper.

In the 32 years I've been involved with COD, I have heard lots of WASes (Wild Ass Stories) regarding COD and many other ships... and without knowing much about you youngsters (or newhands), I needed to hear about how you arrived at your conculsions... which in this case sounds pretty convincing I'll admit.
Now put down that deck wrench and let's go have a drink of Pink Lady and I'll tell you about the vegetable locker that was built into DRUM's sail for watch standers to feed from (no kidding!)...

Paul